[Marticelli]

As someone who has known and worked on Marston Sunbeams for a long time but never before aspired to own one, I read this thread with interest as I have just succumbed (is that the right word?) to a tasty1927 Model 2 which I think is perhaps my ideal choice of machine, for several reasons.

I have always been a sucker for a lost cause, and as Marque Specialist in VMCC over several decades for OEC and Blackburne, you will see I put my money where my mouth is! But having turned 70 recently (years not MPH!) I wanted a light but sensible flat tanker on which I could enjoy my last decade actually riding not fettling or recreating something weird to ride.  (Best example being the sole surviving 1929 OEC Blackburne half-track military model with three wheels in line!)

Before 1927, Sunbeams have beaded edge tyres of which I have plenty, but for a reliable ride, wired-on makes a lot of sense. and as you go past 1927, the bikes become heavier and flat tanks make way for saddle tanks and that lovely lithe vintage look makes way for something chubbier and less attractive to my eye.  I've long held the view that a good 350 is nicer than a good 500, and Sunbeam sensibly built their 350 as a scale model of a 500, so it really is lighter and smaller and more pleasant to ride for a guy like me who is losing his muscles and fitness and finding the bikes I used to ride less manageable than before.

One thing which I've known for ages is a vintage sidevalve isn't like a later sidevalve.  And although Sunbeam introduced their OHV 500 Model 9 in 1927, their sidevalve engine was by then very well developed and is consequently simpler and more trustworthy than the new fangled OHV machine, although I know that earlier OHVs were lightning fast but fragile (but don't tell George Dance!).  It's also got surprisingly good drum brakes despite their relatively feeble appearance.

My new acquisition was owned for ages by a man who was hampered by the loss of his left leg, so the cable operated rear brake meant he could set his Model 2 up with a handlebar lever and no left footrest which also made it hard to steal!  After he went to join the vintage rally in the sky, the new owner returned the bike to standard controls and it has done a lot of running in the past few years so I bought it as a sorted thing not another project, and my first ride confirms my belief that it's pretty well perfect for my present needs.  Time will tell, but I'm looking forward to the Bamburgh Run next month for my first proper outing on 'Promenade Percy' as PP8777 has inevitably been christened.  See you all there!

[Rick Parkington]

Well put, David - I completely agree - it's a perfectly good (and very simple) box used with respect.
But it is a bit more tricky changing back down to 0 from 80 than going up!
I struggled badly with this on my '28 Model 9 at Mallory 1000 bikes. Whatever I tried, I got a terrible grating changing down to second (BT gearset) for the hairpin and I longed for the 4 speed on my '32.
I blamed it partly on flywheel inertia. Usually for changing down with hand change, I leave the throttle part open so when I take my gear-hand off the bar and pull in the clutch the revs go up, giving me a 'blip' to change down - but the 'beam's heavy flywheels made the blip too sluggish to help.
My mistake: someone told me that the three speeds in a Sunbeam gearbox are not first second and third but pulling away, town and country. I have found this to be perfectly true. The flywheel weight means the engine accommodates a wide range of speeds in each gear; with a bit of retard you can chug along happily at a very slow pace in top and pull cleanly out of it without a down-change.
This in mind I took a different approach to the hairpin the next year, pulling the clutch and letting the revs drop to tickover before changing down. No more horrible noises and we seemed to get round just as quickly, so that's the method I adopt always now - it's kind of one step along from the old 'clutch 2-3-change' for Burman foot-change boxes - you just count for a bit longer!
cheers Rick

[DavidG]

Further to this, I reckon don't be scared of the 3-speed boxes: properly set up (and it's not rocket science, just logical) you can go from 0-80mph with just two simple gear changes: my old Model 9 just falls into second from top, and snicks easily into top from second - a real pleasure!

[Rick Parkington]

I'd certainly agree with Thomas and Paul but just to add a bit more, all the 4 speed (1932 onward) Sunbeams are constant mesh gearboxes - whether Sunbeam's own or Burman - so don't be put off all Sunbeam boxes thinking they are 'crash' type. The 4 speed Sunbeam box is very easy to live with the only thing being that it is (usually) hand change so it depends whether you want to try that as a new riding experience or stick to something more familiar.
Hand change doesn't take too long to get used to with regular riding and with these torquey old engines it's not like a modern bike where you are changing gear all the time to keep in the power range. 
I haven't had anything to do with the AMC 'hi cam' Sunbeams but they seem to be pretty scarce and I would imagine spare parts/information would be much harder to find than for Marston bikes.
Good luck with whatever you choose!
Cheers Rick   

[phutton]

Don't be afraid of hand gearchange and lever throttles - hugely satisfying when you get the hang of it, and it won't take long. If you can face this, your range of options would be so much wider. Some unkind critics always say that the AMC Sunbeams aren't really Sunbeams, but I rather like them!

Whatever you choose, with the support of the Club you will really enjoy it.

Regards

Paul

[Thomas]

Hi Alan,

I don't think there is an answer on your question, because preferences are very individual and depend on subjective points. What does "the best model" mean? Some say flattanks are the best, others the Lions, and still others the later models. I think this is irrelevant. I recommend following your own wishes and just try to find a bike that you like. What others say is not important.

Cheers, Thomas

[Alan Haynes]

Hi Everyone,

As someone newly retired and now able to indulge their interest in old motorcycles without the interruption of work, I have joined the MSC&R as I'm looking to expand my collection with a Sunbeam. I am not interested in the later BSA produced S7 & S8 but I do like the later Marston Sunbeams and the short-lived AMC produced Hi-cam models. As a larger chap I think I need a 500cc single at least. Never having ridden a hand-change or crash gearbox, it would seem that my choice is between the later Model 9s with Burman gearbox or the AMC B25 or B28

My question is which is the better option. On the one hand the Model 9 has a lengthy development history,so the 1936 to 1938 models should be the best of the bunch. However I like the style of the AMC produced bikes a bit more but as these were in production for little more than a year, how many might be available and were there any design glitches that weren't ironed out due to the short production run?

I'd appreciate any views plus any suggestions of alternatives as I do not claim to be an expert of the full range of Sunbeam models.

Thanks

Alan